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SPD causing knee pain?
Hey guys,
Ive always ridden flats, and only recently changed to spd pedals. Ive never had any sort of knee pain as long as ive been riding, and whether or not its coincidence, ive got knee pain in my right leg after every ride now. Not sure if its due to the new pedals or just bad timing...
Not being too familiar with clip ins, is there a particular setup that may reduce pain? Is there something obvious to others that i may be overlooking? The pedals are quite easy to get in and out of, no dramas there. And i have the cleats in a central position ie. middle of sole, and middle position in terms of how far forward/back it can be
Its giving me the shits big time, as its seriously limiting my time on the bike. Im thinking about going back to flats if it doesn't improve soon.
Cheers
Ben
Replies to This Discussion
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Permalink Reply by Jeremy S on -
Hey Ben - its not that unfamiliar for people that use the shimano SPD pedals to complain of knee pain. I think the problem comes down to there not being a lot of 'float' in the pedal. It seems a lot of the guys will go for a pedal like the Candy's which have a vey generoud amount of float - up to 15deg i think. You are doing the right thing by trying different cleat positions but if this doesn't solve the problem you may need to try a different pedal. I think the LOOK pedals also offer some float in there design. The good thing with the shimano pedals is that firm and loud click when you go in - i tried a mates LOOK pedals for a week or so and there was not a lot of audible click to let me know i was locked in. I hear the same of the CB's. Dont go back to flats though - stick with the clips (clipless).
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Permalink Reply by Angus Campbell on -
Ben,
I may be stating the obvious but did you check that the distance from seat to pedal hasn't changed? With a change in shoes and pedal platform you may want to revisit this distance. If your pedals are too low you can get a pain across the top of your knee, if your pedals are too high you can also get pains in the knee. As you are experiencing pain in only 1 knee it also maybe because you legs are slightly different lengths, and as you weren't clicked in before you may not have noticed this. The float of the pedal can also induce knee pain if you aren't used to being clicked in.
Firstly I would check seat height first and then slowly work your way through the other possibilities, and if you do make any changes to positioning on your bike do only one change at a time and make changes small, that way you can quickly determine what has the biggest effect on your knee pain.
Good luck.
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Permalink Reply by Mark Caldwell on -
have a look at this http://www.australiancyclist.com.au/article.aspx?aeid=2825
I will look for some set up info for you, or if you like i am happy to take a look at you and your bike and see if there any set up issues.
Sometimes the smallest change can make everything work.
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Permalink Reply by Jeremy S on
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Angus - i would say not the obvious at all, the distance to pedal didnt even occur to me. Another possible factor now that you have pointed that out is the pedal angle as the foot come through the back stroke. I found that when i went to clipless i was more aware of my pedal rhythm and where on flats my toes pointed downwards slightly on the bottom part of the stroke with clipless as i was more aware i started to bring my foot through the bottom part of the stroke quite flat. Ben if you are doing this even though you are pivoting the foot at the ankle it could be having a knock on effect to the knee.
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Permalink Reply by Michael D Hanslip on -
Absolutely SPD pedals cause knee pains. Not only are the biomechanically quite different than flats, but they literally lock you into a position that is more likely to be wrong than right. I make that statement based on a long time doing bike fits and working in bike retail - you have much more chance of setting up your cleats wrong than right.
Check out what another cycle coach has to write about this topic- he advocates that everyone who isn't racing go on flats. I am not quite so extreme in my thinking, but I do recommend that all of my skills class students give flats a go to improve their bike control.
You can move the cleats fore and aft, side to side (a small amount in some systems, none in others), rotationally and then there are the knock-on effects on seat height and even saddle setback to consider.
Even though I have a system I use on people that come to me for cleat placement issues, I can't guarantee that I'll get it right. It is somewhat more difficult to do your own because you can't watch yourself pedal.
Oh, by the way, you don't require a leg length discrepancy to have issue in only one leg. If you put your seat height up slightly too much, your brain will pick a side to win and a side to lose. The side that wins will slide over on the seat or rotate the pelvis that direction in order to effectively lengthen that leg. That means the side that loses will be out by 2x (or more) the seat height excess. That leg then quickly gets an overuse issue with stretching too far. You have to raise the saddle quite a lot too much to cause a problem in both legs, and by then you probably say to yourself "my seat is too high".
If you don't have a good reason to stay on SPDs, do go back to flats.
Cheers,
Michael.
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Permalink Reply by Christopher Giuliano on -
Ben,
Throughout the last twenty years I've gone to and fro flats and clips. Three or four years ago I was playing with a dog that butted my knee and I was off the bike for weeks. Once I got back on the bike my knee ached and I caused further problems as I unknowingly favoured one leg and pedalled badly with the bad leg and ended up with a muscle imbalance that pulled my kneecap to one side slightly, but enough to rub on bits underneath it. I then needed physio to get back on the bike. Clips made my knee ache at night, flats did not, so I stuck to flats while recovering and learned to love them even more.
After training and racing for a year and a half my legs were as strong as ever, and knee pain was a distant memory. After having a horrendous James Williamson 75km, I switched to clips for the Tathra Enduro but that caused pain (even after taking GREAT care to emulate my flats positions). So now I'm on flats for good, which doesn't mind me or my style at all. I ride enduros with different seat heights: no problem, so I don't think that is the problem. I also think seat height is dynamic in MTB - we are not roadies, our terrain is up and down and so should our seats be IMHO
Flats have no float at all, so 'not enough float' is not the problem either, again, IMHO.
Since I gave up training after Tathra Enduro, I've noticed that even flats make my knee ache on half-hour commutes as my legs get weaker every week. My two cents is that when my legs are strong, I get no pain. Would that be a contributing factor with you?
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Permalink Reply by Jeremy S on
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Damn - i dont even have sore knees and you lot have just about talked me out of using SPD's.
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Permalink Reply by Milto on
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SPD's are great. The only reason I train is to make the leg imbalance even worse as one leg gets stronger.
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Permalink Reply by John Brinsmead on -
Christopher Giuliano said:
Since I gave up training after Tathra Enduro, I've noticed that even flats make my knee ache on half-hour commutes as my legs get weaker every week. My two cents is that when my legs are strong, I get no pain. Would that be a contributing factor with you?
A friend of mine, who coaches Athletics and Hockey, makes a point that muscular strength and endurace can cover damage to the knee (and other) joints - so when an individual's fitness drops off any underlying issues can come to the for...
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Permalink Reply by Jeremy S on
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Milto am i reading this wrong or are you taking the piss?
Milto said:SPD's are great. The only reason I train is to make the leg imbalance even worse as one leg gets stronger.
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Permalink Reply by Steve K on -
LOL Milto, classic :) Jeremy if you have ridden with Milto it will make sense :)
I love SPD's but can see how they could cause problems for those that are sensitive (or maybe just not insensitive) to bike setup.. Luckily I'm not one of those.
Ben to see if it is the pedals, and you're sure the bike is fitting (as well as it used to, anyway), then it shouldn't be too hard to swap back to your old flats for a couple of rides? That would tell you if it's the pedal change, or Old Timers Disease? :)
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